New NVIDIA Press Embargo Stirs Things Up
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RealNC
I think the core issue is that if you are not allowed to report on what you want, you are not a journalist. You're just a press release outlet. In other words, a PR tool. Heise, AFAICT, does actual journalism, which involves reporting on matters that NVidia (or any other company) would prefer to not be reported about.
Imagine if this was happening in politics. Like if the BBC signed an NDA with the British government not to report on any matters obtained through informers. Ever.
Of course politics and computer hardware are not the same thing, but journalistic integrity for sites that actually do journalism should still be important, regardless of the content matter, and signing NDAs that never expire or are unreasonably long means you can't be trusted by the consumers.
Silva
I'm disappointed about you signing this HH.
It's normal to have NDA so you can get the reviewing samples early, and release the review at the same time as everyone else.
But this is different, what Nvidia wants is that no one make news posts about leaked information of new products, this is not only anti journalism but anti consumer too.
It's too soon after GPP, and it's right at the same time we hear about Nvidia having too much GPU stock. And CEO said on the beginning of this month we would have to wait a long time for new GPUs.
I'm truly disappointed in Guru3D for signing up to this BS and hope more people like Heise don't put their trousers down for Nvidia.
reix2x
i would love to read the GPP also.
fantaskarsef
Maybe @Hilbert Hagedoorn can answer me this:
What's the worst that can happen to any such journalist NOT signing that NDA? That you're late with your articles when the NDA dates lift, taking you longer to prepare the numbers and graphs etc.?
What does Nvidia offer those that actually sign it in the first place? Inside scoops that you're not allowed to write about?
I'm not sure why anybody would sign that, besides the point that these days, the first to put out such information on their site seemingly earns the most money with it?
Hilbert Hagedoorn
Administrator
Everybody, everywhere in all media signs these and have been doing so for two decades.
Not signing them, =no samples, no info beforehand, no technical briefings. NDAs have been here ever since I am in the technology field since 1997. This one isn't that different.
We'll post regardless of what an NDA states, the good and the bad. Nothing changes on this end and it's as simple as that.
Mufflore
What will be the penalty for breaking the NDA in that fashion?
They have shot themselves in the foot behaving this way.
I no longer want to read news about NVidia products after all this.
Wintergreen
Isn't this 'recipient shall use confidential information solely for the benefit of NVIDIA' the most conerning part? What precisely is meant by that? If they ship a bad GPU, you can't say that? As surely that would not be in 'their benefit'? While people may have been signing these for years, perhaps it is indeed time this was brought out in the light so people know what they are reading exactly, and if anything has been censored.
Hilbert Hagedoorn
Administrator
None really, I can remember one website who posted an entire GeForce GTX review way before release, like weeks. They have been blacklisted for a year I think, e.g. received no further samples and info. That's as bad, as I heard, as it went.
We'll see where this heads though, less stringent NDAs would definitely have my preference. But as stated, it's been part of this industry for decades and I do not see that changing anytime soon.
RealNC
Guru3D signing this is not really an big issue, IMO. It's a product review site and press release outlet.
A site like Heise, Ars Technica, The Register or The Inquirer signing this is what is, IMO, unacceptable.
vbetts
Moderator
Pretty much I think this boils down to interpretation.
Would Nvidia consider one saying the new GTXZ 203940 is good at playing games at 16k, but requires a buttload of power to do so bad? Or the card is quiet but only has 2 fans when it needs 6?
I also think this is more towards certain communities, and Nvidia's way of keeping some of these in check that have had a crap ton to say about GPP. Communities like Guru3d, which hasn't said anything horrible about a product to the point where it's just insulting it, are safe.
cowie
Hilbert its true you can report on unknown sources as long as its not NVidia as the source
its more bitching about nothing again....but please you ultra smart guys just try to make it out to be what amd does in their dictated reviews
this nda is not trying to tell Hilbert what to write but you internet smart people just go ahead and say that.
this is not ocn go over to them losers and you guys can cry together about nothing
fantaskarsef
Well, I'll trust Hilbert to have his own opinion to the practices that Nvidia does here, but honestly, it reads quite fishy... same intent behind it as with GPP, as far as I can guess.
All in all, we have to trust Hilbert, that this new NDA agreement does let him post whatever he wants, and that it does not hinder his journalistic work.
Heard of 4K yet? They soon reach 100+Hz on those 😀
RealNC
So what you're saying is that if you're not allowed to tell the truth, should the need arise, because it would sound insulting, it's fine :-/
For a site like Guru3D, that might be fine. For others, not so much. Heise signing this would mean anything Heise says about NVidia is only good to wipe your butt with.
Sites like Heise are sourced/cited by a crapload of other sites, including Guru3D. If these sites get "compromised", then that means everyone else who sources them is also affected.
Hilbert Hagedoorn
Administrator
I already answered that ... from my side, nothing changes nor will change in our content.
We've never been or felt pressured by NV, neither would I allow them to do so as I'll write whatever I want to say. But if they send out a new Turing (and yes that is a hypothetical), and I decide to post all kinds of photos and tech info prior to release and embargo date in a news item .. well that's pretty much what these NDAs are designed for.
vbetts
Moderator
I don't agree with it at all, all I'm saying is that's what it seems they're doing. Not saying it's right or justified, at this point I'm kind of not surprised seeing any anticonsumer practices from Nvidia.
RealNC
What's the point of NDAs if you can ignore them?
cowie
basicly the need to lie is what they discourage
what you think they don't know what thier hardware can do? how hot overclocks?
more bs to run with go for it
Mufflore
Thats more than none, its a 1 year outright ban and no doubt they suffer future issues.
I suspect penalties will be far stronger after this.
Take a look at the 5 year clause they built in to it, they want blood from dissenters!
If your reason for signing the NDA is to receive early samples and info, cutting those off makes you effectively the same as someone who hasnt signed the NDA.
Except you are still bound to conform to the NDA if you ever want to get back on a good footing.
It enforces restricted/controlled journalism.
Fediuld
I wonder how this could have affected the GTX970 scandal, does under this NDA means that we shouldn't have known about the less ROP than advertised and the 3.5GB VRAM only operating at full speed? Because given when the card came out, media outlets like Guru3d shouldn't reported out that until September 2019!!!!!!!
fantaskarsef
I can actually see and understand @RealNC 's concerns. But with this new NDA I think it's a little blown up (like Hilbert said in his article), and secondly, it's a matter of interpretation. Unless Hilbert's not allowed to say -anything- bad about NV (which usually is their behaviour and their pricing), it won't change much.
But if an investigative site signs any such NDAs, the question is, what would have happend when Nvidia really did something that's not right? A site that cites sources that really put out intel about the skeletons inside Nvidia's closet? We'd probably never learn (or care) 😀
