Agonist:

No we hate the cars. We are pro performance and pro manual. Anything auto and electric is blah. Tesla is trash in all the regards. They are ugly as well. What is there to like about them? They are far better electric cars to praise anyways.

About gearbox... there is none on a real electric car, so the problem on auto or manual doesnt exist. gearbox were invented to make thermic engine with piston usable due to the really narrow usable range and the low efficiency of the solution. On electric with nearly 99% the torque aviable right away, you don't need it. And about tesla itself, right now they have many step away from closest outsider... even audi/vw use tesla to help them on electric concept, and you found tesla technology in many other outsider batteries.

SmootyPoody:

I hope you are being sarcastic. Otherwise the marketing has really hit you.

Nah man, this car is clearly not meant to be driven on roads. Drag strip or shallow curve courses only for this super car! (im sarcastically jabbing at the guy you quoted)

Agonist:

No we hate the cars. We are pro performance and pro manual. Anything auto and electric is blah. Tesla is trash in all the regards. They are ugly as well. What is there to like about them? They are far better electric cars to praise anyways.

Yeah... not real enthusiasts as far as I'm concerned. A real enthusiast can even appreciate a Yugo. Electric is the future of performance vehicles. Basically every major company is making an electric performance vehicle or hybrid, and it makes sense. You get immense amounts of torque and it's instantaneous. Say what you want about a naturally aspirated engine with a mechanical throttle body but you're never going to get the same level of response. Turbos and superchargers squeeze in a lot of torque but it takes time for it to build up. As pointed out by rl66, most production electrics don't have gearboxes. Some might have 2 gears, one for overdrive. If you're actually an enthusiast, you'd know there is a massive community revolving around people swapping out combustion engines with electric drivetrains and preserve the original manual gearbox. I myself am building one, with a 4 speed manual (don't really have a use for a 5th gear; don't really have a use for 1st gear either). My daily is a Subaru with the original flat-4 and a 5-speed manual, because I appreciate variety. Like it or not but Tesla is what triggered the industry shift. Back in 2016, Telsa got a 0-60 time in 2.5 seconds and quarter mile times around 10 seconds, in a sedan that weighs as much as a midsize SUV. That's off the production line, with all the unnecessary bells and whistles. You mean to tell me that's not fast? Do you really think it wouldn't be fun to be pressed into the back of your seat like that? Performance wasn't even a top priority, because the motors actually weren't built to handle high speeds. There's plenty to like about them. They have good range. They have good safety features. They make your life more convenient in simple ways. They're quiet. They have interesting technologies that push the industry. They're fast. Are they the best electric cars? Depending on your needs/preferences, no, definitely not. I wouldn't buy one. But the whole thing about being a car enthusiast is having choices, and respecting others'.

I wish that governments ban distracting features in cars. Cars are like power tools. You have to pay attention while driving a car. You don't want to use cell phone while using a table saw.

SmootyPoody:

I hope you are being sarcastic. Otherwise the marketing has really hit you.

it's the fastest production car on earth 0-60 and it seats 4 that is a super car

schmidtbag:

Electric is the future of performance vehicles.

Porsche fully ICE 911 Turbo S would like to have a word with you about that. [youtube=9L3n9xCSg9o] I am pretty sure Car WOW had done a video with the 911s against a Cheeta stance Model S but the only one I could find was the Taycan Turbo S.... guess who lost in that race as well... yup the Tesla. Schooled by Porsche in a car that was heavier, with less power and Porsches first attempt at a full EV as well. As for the cockpit of the Tesla, awful but then this trend towards touchscreens in cars is a generally awful design philosophy as a standard, one that really does need to die soon and as others have pointed out the steering wheel is laughable in this design, unless this is one of the BS Space X variant cars that is going to have rockets and will be able to fly

The Laughing Ma:

Porsche fully ICE 911 Turbo S would like to have a word with you about that.

First of all, the Model S isn't a performance car, so you're already comparing apples to oranges. Second, the 2021 Porsche Taychan would like to have a word with you about the 911 Turbo S. I repeat: Electric is the future of performance.

As for the cockpit of the Tesla, awful but then this trend towards touchscreens in cars is a generally awful design philosophy as a standard, one that really does need to die soon and as others have pointed out the steering wheel is laughable in this design, unless this is one of the BS Space X variant cars that is going to have rockets and will be able to fly

I agree. I want physical dials for climate control and media volume. At least we're past that awful point where companies were using like 30 buttons.

Meanwhile, I want to have a word with Porsche about what a turbo is. (Taycan Turbo S) 😛

I can bet that steering wheel is illegal ij EU. Wont pass for sure

schmidtbag:

First of all, the Model S isn't a performance car, so you're already comparing apples to oranges.

No I am comparing an ICE vehicle to an EV. Only a few years ago everyone (well the Tesla fanboys) said that ICE would never be able to pull the gap, it just wasn't possible. Look at what the Model S can do. Then Porsche turns up with what isn't even their top flight car, it doesn't have any fancy hybrid nonsense, it isn't pulling some outlandish sillyness with it's gearbox or engine setup or power delivery, it isn't even hugely powerful when compared to what some ICE vehicles can output, it's just a very well sorted ICE car and not only does it beat the Model S it beats it with it's latest and supposedly fastest software update. The Chiron will do 0 - 60 in 2.5 seconds. The question is is there an EV that can outgun it? What about to 100? What about to 200? What about 300? What about 400? EVs undoubtedly have the performance but there always seems to be a caveat attached to it and this isn't just at the high end this also applies to the bottom end as well. Is there an EV out there that can do a 300mile trip in 4 and a half hours but costs the price of a Dacia Duster or is the size of a VW Fox? (that's 300 miles at the UK national speed limit of 70mph with a bit of change to spare for stops and a refuel)

0blivious:

Meanwhile, I want to have a word with Porsche about what a turbo is

To be honest Vauxhall have been sticking 'Turbo' badges on their cars for years, even when their cars don't actually have Turbos. Audi have started doing some weird numbering system with their cars. I passed an Audi A1 2.5 on the motorway a few months ago and thought... hmmm the only cars that have 2.5l engines are the RS4 models, nope turns out it's a spec description. Looks like Auto makers are using traditional performance badging as nothing more than a way of naming trim and spec levels now.

The Laughing Ma:

No I am comparing an ICE vehicle to an EV. Only a few years ago everyone (well the Tesla fanboys) said that ICE would never be able to pull the gap, it just wasn't possible. Look at what the Model S can do. Then Porsche turns up with what isn't even their top flight car, it doesn't have any fancy hybrid nonsense, it isn't pulling some outlandish sillyness with it's gearbox or engine setup or power delivery, it isn't even hugely powerful when compared to what some ICE vehicles can output, it's just a very well sorted ICE car and not only does it beat the Model S it beats it with it's latest and supposedly fastest software update.

There's a reason hardly anything has a 0-60/100 faster than 2.4 seconds: there's only so much you can do to improve grip. Obviously, a pure ICE can pull that off. That's not that hard to do. There are ICE engines that have the power to go much faster, if grip wasn't a problem. But there are 2 important things to consider: 1. It takes an absurd powerplant and machinery to achieve this goal, and although it weighs less than current battery technologies, the weight isn't very evenly distributed and increases the center of gravity. The complexity and heat means low reliability and more maintenance. Meanwhile, electric motors that weren't built for high speed are able to achieve similar numbers with none of the disadvantages. Imagine what would happen if a motor was actually built for speed. 2. Torque curves and transmissions. An ICE gradually builds up torque and after a certain point, it slowly starts to drop. A transmission is an absolute necessity in order to keep the revs in the proper range. Electric motors have peak torque at 1RPM and it gradually slows down as RPM increases. As a result, an ICE is inherently slower to accelerate from a stop, but can sustain acceleration at higher speeds. In order to compensate for the slow stop acceleration, you need to really beef up the engine. Most production EVs don't have a transmission, since each motor is usually directly connected to the wheels. As a result, there is nothing to help lower the RPM. The 911 was deliberately given enough power to compensate for the poor stop acceleration, and since it has a transmission, it is expected to win in a drag race. So, the point I'm trying to drive home here is it takes a specially designed car to get these numbers. You sacrifice reliability, efficiency, and practicality just so you can have the fastest. Meanwhile, a luxury EV gets pretty damn close without even trying to be fast. Nearly every major performance brand knows the potential of an electric motor, and that's why so many of them are making the transition.

The other reason you don't 0..60 faster then 2.4 seconds is it's brutal and would be extremely dangerous on a public road.